FRA urgent announcement

[kane]

I would be most grateful if you could make your testing methods and findings available for the governing body to discuss.

[maddox]

We did tests with HDPE sheets.
Even with crossbow bolts nor competition bow arrows we couldnt penetrate a plate of 5mm in a flexible stand- like we intend for the roof. from a distance of 1 meter.
And I dare to say, those weapons are especialy penetrating...

A test with a pneumatic ram was equaly disappointing concerning damage on the sheet.

A direct hit from a serious disk at speed will tear it, but , if we take this as a criterium, we need roofs of 6mm hardox or simular.

I can, with a 5 kg sledgehammer dent it permanently, but it just deforms, no penetration seen. Shallower dents disappear after a while.

HDPE is relatively cheap, lightweight-250 grams lighter than polycarbonate for 1 dm³ , easy to work with, and the right grade is resilient against UV light and wont go brittle.

For a roof, the weight is also a concern. Even in the light HDPE (lighter than the lorry sails we see now in use) the full roof of the DRG arena is 600 kg heavy. And that is without the supports.

I shared these findings with several people, of wich one is Grant Cooper.

Roaming Robots€™s position€¦..

Obviously each of us, as event organisers take safety very seriously, and there has been a lot of work been put into producing the new arena guidelines.

This is not about spoiling the events, or stopping people from using their robots, it is about making sure we have a future, making sure that our hobby can continue for as long as possible in a safe manner.

At the meeting to my recollection there was no one present who did not agree with the new set of safety standards. Of course we all have alterations to make, some more than others.

Unfortunately this does mean that we too will not be able to run Feather Weight spinners for 2007 in our main arena. While I am obviously very disappointed that we will loose the excitement of the spinners to our show, I do understand and agree with the reasons behind it.

Lets be realistic, going back even as little as a year, and we didn€™t have such powerful spinners, and we have all noticed that they are getting more and more powerful as each one is redeveloped.

While each of the organisers needs to go away and think about its position, and how they can possibly upgrade the arena to a class 2. The current Roaming Robots main arena will not be able to at this stage. The concept of a full class 2, hard roof arena is both unpractical and unfeasible in the current climate.

What the future brings in RR, you will have to just wait and see !!!!

Roaming Robots has always, and will continue to fully support the FRA and the work which goes on behind the scenes which roboteers may not see or know about.
I would think it would be suicide for an event organiser to ignore the information they have been shown, as I€™m sure the insurance would be completely invalid. This is a situation i hope we never face!!!


John
Roaming Robots

[jamesb]

im having people withdrawing from my event due to changes that were neither made known to me prior to the meeting, nor since. Who exactly was present at this meeting and who voted yes/no? More to the point, who dictated the minimum standards? and why are they qualified to do so?

Family comittments prevented me attending the meeting, as I said they might, so I will hold off on an official comment until I know exactly what the new GUIDELINES are, and their implications.

until I make a formal decision, I will still be allowing featherweight spinner to run in my events, and as my arena spec has not been made public yet, there is no reason to object.

I ask anyone who has withdrawn from my event to reconcider, as my intent is still to run your robots until further notice.

Robots pulling out of events, and roboteers thinking of quitting? not the best results from a safety meeting.

James - I did not attend the meeting, but to shed some light on why these guidlines for running spinners has been changed Ill explain.

We did some testing....(seperate testing was also done by the FRA)
At 100mph - with a 250g projectile of steel, 1 daimetre.
This went clean through 12mm plywood, infact it didnt just go through, it smashed through even when sideways!! It was just about stopped by 18mm plywood, but it did penetrate the other side.
All the other materials except for polycarb including the very tough lorry curtains, even two layers with stanless steel meshing didnt slow the projectile down at very low speeds!

Im sure, even you dont agree with the new guidlines that there must be something done to stop the possibility of things escaping from an arena this easily - to be honest i was extreamly shocked by how badly any materials stood up to impacts.
If you run spinners in an arena not to these specifications, then you run the risk of serious injury and insurance will be invalid.

[maddox]

Roaming Robots has always, and will continue to fully support the FRA and the work which goes on behind the scenes which roboteers may not see or know about.
I would think it would be suicide for an event organiser to ignore the information they have been shown, as I€™m sure the insurance would be completely invalid. This is a situation i hope we never face!!!

*************************************************

Jonno, I doubt that. If your insurance is happy with your current safety standards, who is going to tell them they are wrong?

While I agree that spinners give the audience one of their biggest kicks, their unfortunate absense from forseeable future events will at least allow new blood to have a slightly easier introduction into the sport - surely thats a beneficial by-product of the new guidelines?

Out of interest, do these guidelines apply to cadet class spinners as well? With the restrictions on motor power and spinning mass, wouldnt cadet class spinners pose as lower safety risk than a 2kg-ish Mag-powered spinner? If arenas need to be upgraded to cope with the super-spinners, are the current conditions of arenas not suitable for the lower power cadet spinner? Just wondering what the view of this is?

[jamesb]

removed.
cant be bothered arguing

(Message edited by jamesb on January 21, 2007)

James I think you should repost that! You have a valid point as I was just disgussing the same thing with a few other people and was thinking of posting it myself!

[jamesb]

im done with conflict bex, so sorry bex, im out of this one.