Proposals from the RFL

[tough_as_nails]

I agree with Geoff about people from outside europe who want to fight here. I dont see them losing 1.6kg to come over here for a competition. I think its much easyer for the current feathers to add 1.6kg. I understand that costs are made, but it seems to me that many components can be used again. And if you have spend a forune on it, then it should already be capable of handling 13.6kg opponents.

If it turns out later that there will be more 13.6kg bricks or mega spinners. Then i agree its getting time to look at the rules.

After looking through other peoples posts i think that the change from 12kg to 13.6kg would be a good idea. We could all find ways to add another 1.6kg to our machines. This would enable everyone to build better machines to fight with. If some of the spinners use 1.6kg to increase the power on their disc then everyone else could use it to upgrade their armour.

Just my view.

Will

[tunna]

Geoff we are not featherweight users but what you have said seems perfectly reasonable to me,
if you want to propose the new weight limit
I for one would second it, as Will said I am sure that the extra 1.6 kgs would make European machines more competitive,

My vote will carry little weight but for what its worth, it goes to Geoff etc.

I have always been a firm believer that there should be international rules.

I took offence to the comment that one said, if you can afford to go to the States to compete then you can afford the modifications to bring into their weight limit etc. Thats hardly the point is it? Its damn expensive living in San Francisco for two weeks. Flights, hotels, car hire, food etc let alone another robot!. All of our experience is set into our rule set and to have to rebuild and design a robot just because we want to compete over the pond etc is not good. The difference might be minor but they certainly do make a difference.

Mike.

[tim_jones]

Ill put my hand up and admit to making the comment about mods to a robot being a minor cost factor in competing abroad. It was not meant to cause offence merely to highlight another viewpoint, I apolgise if you felt offended. Bear in mind that many struggle to finance the building and running of a robot within the UK, why should they have to face the need to upgrade to have fun and remain competitive in the UK just so that a few can travel further afield?

It really isnt all that unusual to have different rulesets for different continents in motorsports. Why do we feel such a pressing need to have one ruleset for all countries in our sport?

There are IMHO far bigger issues facing the sport but wed better not go there as I caused far to much offence last time I raised my concerns ;(

Regards

Tim Jones

With respect Geoff, I dont think that being narrow minded is the only possible reason for builders to prefer the current 12kg limit. Builders can have perfectly sensible reasons including financial, aesthetic or time considerations for example. I also dont think its irrelevant or unreasonable to at least bring up the issue of other rule changes that would be necessary to properly harmonise a complete rule set worldwide. Still, that said, as a builder just about to start prototyping his first feather Im perfectly happy with 13.6kg if other UK builders are in favour. I think that ultimately an international standard is a good thing and worth a little compromise, but weight is only the first step. Some of the other issues mentioned above may prove less tractable!

The biggest challenge at this point in time regarding weight is international roboteers competing in our country. Losing any weight in a feather is difficult, losing 10% impossible.

This isnt a case of us having to increase weight to compete... we are already within the rules in that respect. Its being accomodating so that others may build to a weight and that weight be valid anywhere in the world.

This isnt a financial issue either; building a heavier feather makes the sport more accessable for those on a tighter budget. Cost is usually proportional to the quality of materials available. For example, Titanium is around half the weight of steel but costs significantly more. Of course, if you work it right, neither costs anything.

[grant_ploughbot]

I may not have cottoned onto this properly, but why cant people over the pond adjust to 12kg?
I may seem narrow minded, but i really can see the spinners and the billets taking over. Atleast at 12kg you need to comprimise between weapons/power and armour.

With an extra 1.6kg i could up my armour to 4mm hardox all over, and still have astro drive and heavier grippier wheels. I would have no fun doing that though! likewise i would have no fun building a mega spinner such as the sort JB mentioned could be possible to produce!! Either no one will fight it-or a billet will just bounce off.
If some of the spinners use 1.6kg to increase the power on their disc then everyone else could use it to upgrade their armour.

Thats my views

[tough_as_nails]

Grant, Thats why an international weight class is the first step we have to make. When we have upgraded our machines to 13.6kg, the next step is to look at the rules for safety. And if armour gets to thick and spinners to powerfull we have to look at that aswell. But we can only tell how the robots will evolve after we tried it i think.

(Message edited by tough_as_nails on July 21, 2006)

(Message edited by tough_as_nails on July 21, 2006)

Kane - Quote This isnt a financial issue either; building a heavier feather makes the sport more accessable for those on a tighter budget.

This is the reason i vote for 13.6kg.
I could then finish my feather tomorrow without having to fart about trying to get under the 12kg (Which currently i am struggling with on a tight budget!)

And secondly i think it would be great to see more Americans and maybe Aussies coming over to play!