Clusterbot immobilisation rules

[Flag Captured]

So, I was looking at the rules the other day (as you do) and I've seen that the 1 part immobile/ whole cluster is out rule is still in place - I'm not one to try and change the rules or anything but is there any reason this is the case instead of a 60 or 75% of the weight rule like I believe the SPARC and RFL rulesets use?

My sentiment with regards clusters is that if you lose a half you shouldn't be classed as immobile since you can still fight, but obviously it's going to count hugely against you in the case of a judges decision... I think that's fair considering the disadvantages you put yourself at by having machines of lesser weight. It also pretty much entirely shuts out clusters like the ones on Battlebots, specifically like Witch Doctor & Shaman and I like the diversity that sort of design brings, good for the sport and all that.

It probably won't stop me building a cluster (I've got one going to the Beetle champs already even though it's somewhat less competitive) but it'd be nice to see them a little more viable, I think the current ruling on it is just a bit too restrictive for machines of this type and I think that's reflected in the lack of clusterbots at present...

[daveimi]

I agree with you, I was looking for an excuse to build a cluster...

[john_frizell]

My interpretation of the Battlebots rules is that a Multibot [their word for cluster] is not out until it has lost over 50% of its units by weight. They are not explicit on that and I'll ask them to clarify but I think that is their practice. For example their rules specify: 'If no single Multibot segment exceeds 50% of the total eight of all segments, a sticker will be applied to each segment indicating that segment's weight.' and 'If a competitor robot is a Multibot, judges must be informed, prior to the match, of the weights and descriptions of each of the segments.'
We saw that in the most recent series when Witch Doctor was immobilized the match was over, even though their second [smaller] robot, Shaman was still fighting. But in the Warrior Clan match against Nightmare, the total destruction of one of the Warrior Clan minibots did not stop the match and they went on to win.

[ady]

Don't know what's changed but when I ran a fw cluster (double trouble) a few years ago, the weight was split around 55/45 if the lighter got immobilised I could continue, the heavier I ceased, no one ever checked at end of the fight too see if I was fibbing over which half was still working, but I played fair. They are identical to look at so unless you put them on the scales you wouldn't tell.
Not sure how it's changed as it was many moons ago!
I didnt see any advantage of clusters except for something different and a bit of fun, having a robot half the weight (even though you have 2) makes it very hard to be competitive. A flipper would bounce mine off robochallenges roof!
You also want a mech to split the 2 halfs as it needs to go in as 1 then split!
Which reminds me their still in my workshop somewhere I really should dig them out :-)

[Flag Captured]

This is sort of my point though with regards the Battlebots clusters, we'll never see that type of design over here because let's face it, who'll put a tiny robot that would be an extremely easy KO? Would seriously love to see one kind of variation on that though some time (and a side note, massively jealous that you've seen both of those robots in person hahaha)

I get what you're saying with them not being as competitive too Ady, but they'll struggle even more with this sort of ruleset in place... I reckon a competitive cluster could be done though with brushless and lipos being the norm. Would be tough but I reckon it'd be worth an attempt at least!

[ady]

Mine are proper old school engineering. 2wd cordless drill, sabertooth controlled wedges running on 2 X 8.4v packs in series, with a 2mm steel floor, steel box section frame, 5mm steel welded scoop, 10mm hdpe sides and lid. They were strong as heck and even after bouncing off the roof still ran, they had surprisingly good pushing power would take a spinner hit no probs but with almost zero ground clearance if a flipper got under them it was game over.
I just built them as a father and daughter bit of fun about 10 years ago. A lot has evolved since then so anything is possible, they used to get a lot of attention from fans asking questions about them, but if you build a cluster I think both halfs have to be the same, like Gemini was

[Phill]

I have a couple of questions and it seems best to bump a thread than start a new one.

Is the old rule about starting together still in place as post four indicates? It isn't in the rules as far as I can see.

If one of the cluster bots loses drive on one side is that a loss for the entire bot? Or is it just counted as a high amount of damage if it goes to judges but isn't a straight loss?

I assume one cluster half going down the pit is a loss of course, under normal circumstances, but if say TAN has hold of one of two clusters, then as its pushing it towards the pit the other half of the cluster pushes TAN in too is that a victory for the cluster? Maybe some weird draw?

What if roles of first aggressor were reversed and the cluster pushed a bot in, but followed in some way like it doesn't stop or is caught up, does that equal a win still?

[Flag Captured]

I think the current ruling for Robot Wars is 55% of the total weight has to be immobilised to be counted out

For every other class at the minute anyway it's one part out, whole robot out.