Thoughts for a Future Arena Floor Design

I have been thinking about ideas for a new arena design for a long time and its getting time to start gathering ideas ready for the future.

I have spoken to a few people who have liked the idea but thought id put it out for general discussion.

The idea:

A multi level arena.

The arena floor would consist of seperate sections, each at different levels. Now im not talking anything major. Say for example the floor surface split into thirds, raising up by 10mm / 15mm with each step.

The idea is to add a bit more tactics into the fights rather than the current flipper fest where it is normally who ever has the lowest front scoop.

it will hopefully lead to much more tactical fights, robots maybe having to reverse up steps to get to their opponents, maybe the lower most section is the house robot zone...

maybe ramps to get you up their, or if you have the ground clearance you can hop up the steps.

Now you may poo poo this idea, but i dont know!!

The idea comes from one of my educational projects i ofen run which involves sumo, however i always impose a minimum ground clearance rule of 10mm to stop it being whoever has the lowest front, it certainly makes it more entertaining.

Thoughts very welcome.

John
http://www.RoamingRobots.co.ukwww.RoamingRobots.co.uk

I like the concept for fun events, not nessasarily for championships or major events though.
It could add a great entertaining factor to a show, but it could also add the adverse effect if a robot gets stuck, or can-not manuver very well. Also it has the possibility of a totally torn up floor when flippers are in the arena (unless you make the steps from steel?)
It could work, always interesting to try out new ideas.

I think the main critism to the idea is that it will ground alot of robots. And you might have a fight where it ends with every one stuck.
I agree with the situation with flippers rulling the arena but I am not sure on this idea.

The Hannibalitos wont have any problems, nor would have Gravity had any issues with that.
It just means a different style of driving.

On the flipper issue. Its a lot simpler, take a leaf from the antweight arena.
Just set part of the arena so that there isnt an OOTA possible. FLIP, Boing, back in the arena.

If you ant to make uneven ground, imagine the damage that will do to the floor. We see it now, with the flush floor, even a minute unevenness induces arena floor damage. Imagine a double whammy from a robot and his chaser slamming into a 15mm height difference. I hope that is thick steel, or else the angle grinder/saw will be a good friend.

Oh I dont know. It would make zero ground clearance a thing of the past - the dream of every flipper...:mrgreen:

A multi-level arena - when the kids in the audience already have trouble watching the fights. In Colchester there was at one point an entire family that had to stand upright aside the tribune and seats because otherwise the kids couldnt see a thing. Visibility will also become a problem for the roboteers, unless you put them somewhere high. 21-way featherweight mªlee someone ?

But please continue thinking... there must be a way to make the fights more challenging.

Interesting idea. But I guess that most existing feathers would have difficulty coping with it and you would wind up with feathers restricted to the lower third.

A good idea to make fights more challenging but a spectacle for the audience; I don€™t think it will make much difference to their enjoyment. Are most people not there to watch robotwars and at the moment that€™s what we give them, will a tiered arena make much difference?

If you want to reduce the flipper fest. Bring back the old arena!:)

what about if u made an arena like a multi storey carpark? lool u could have ramps going to certain parts that are reaised say a meter and it would just make it more entertaining having robots fall off n that sort of thing :P

Or you could make the arena an anti-gravity chamber.:)

We can debate it all we want but I think until it is tried at an event we wont have an idea as to whether or not it will work.

Jonno would it be possible to make the stepped sections removable so that if the idea wasnt working between shows it could be removed? I say go for it and see what happens!

I also like marios idea of having an arena without an OOTA possible, either that or have only one side where it is possible.

Settled then John, bring back old arena, no OOTA!

Colour code the different levels,
Tell the audience about this,
and give it a go, until we try to fight on this new arena we wont know. Saint Mallet wont mind a bit the old saint might struggle but it can be modified to work.
Remember in England the universal rule applies

€œFor every action there is an equal and opposite criticism.€

:)

tom, i dont think so :P

all robots will be killed from KO, Thor n Thz attacking them :sad:

i say just have like 2 sides of the arena where we can flip out

and 2 pits and 2 flippers

You wouldn€™t get killed you just need to drive better, it was a lot easier to stack a robot in the old arena so if driving is good from flippers then you will be alright.

Having 2 sides of the arena where being flipped out isn€™t possible is a good idea but I don€™t think it will do that much as flippers can just carefully position Parallel to a wall where it is possible to flip out at the beginning of a battle.

i like the idea of tiered arena but there is the risk of lots of robots getting grounded. also robots going from the raised tier will damage the floor when hitting the lower tier. making say 1 side oota only area would make for better fights. raising the other 3 sides could obscure the audience but then if you just added another rail to the one there now wouldnt be too bad.

I always thought it would be a good idea to have tiered floors, like if there was a large raised central section and then the area where the house robots patrolled was recessed slightly...that combined with eliminating OOTAs on some walls might reduce the amount of wedge flippers we have. It would also encourage tracks, which is a good thing from my warped point of view.

Before we modified our arena (when seperation zones were not a must in the regulations) we were just going to extend one side to incorporate a seperation zone so that it was possible, but more of a task to get an OOTA using only one of the smaller sides of the arena. But when upgrading the rules were changing and so that changes our planes. I do still beleive that reducing the number our areas for OOTAs would be a good adea, more-so than the floor. I beleive combat is combat, not fighting the arena which is why i prefer this method of making things a little more fun

U thinking of doing a Design ur own arena competition Jonno?

The antweight arena can do ootas but only 2 sides. but on those sides there are no walls either, so you could be pushed out as well.

I dont know if I like the idea of the multi layered arena, i gues i would have to try it before i could really pass judgement over it. I do realise some robot will not be able to move (much) in an arena like that.

i hate ootas

never been done to tanto but still its getting dull now

well i havent posted on forums in ages, still come on forum every day to have a look and see whats going on but not had anything usefull or of any interest to say, todays no different but i feel like posting.Cant there just be a raised perimeter? would reduce the chance of low ground clearance flippers just getting under there opponent and driving them straight to the side wall and flipping them OOTA. just have like a 10-15mm raised perimeter like 500-1000mm wide. have it clearly marked as a raised area and maybe let House robots attack for no reason in that area too.
Told u it would be a post that wasnt usefull or of any interest to anyone :p.

A tiered arena has potential a lot of thought needs to go into this on the aspect of floor design. Ramps are a very good idea although it would means ground clearances on some machines would have to be increase. Why stop at 10 - 15mm, if we made the steps somewhere between 50 & 100mm floor design & structure would make it easier to protect edges of the floor. I know there are many machines that cant cope with that height which is where the ramps would come into play. Food for thought for the future.

John

Dantomkia on the other hand would relish a stepped arena as she is capable of keeping her points on the floor when needed and can also drive up a 3 - 4in kerbstone and then drive across the grass if she wants!! Could be fun:rofl:

PINBALL
Robots have to compete in a timed competition scoring as many points as possible.
Various obsticles are scored... see-saw, etc.

Like series 3 or 4, I cant remember. I do remember being 8 though and just waiting for the pinball thing to end so it would get back to the battles. Fun for the roboteers, bit boring for an 8 year old boy who came to see some destruction!

im liking the ideas, not sure of my fave, but i agree jonno that something fresh is needed and i also agree with Grant that it shouldnt be at every event, more a fun thing and see where it goes.



(Message edited by promo robots on March 31, 2008)

Well I personally think its time for a change.

If its going to go back on TV which it will one day soon, one thing is for sure it wont be in the current format.

In my opinion, sticking two robots in a box, has had its day.
Robotica was getting there I think, but not done very well for a live show, more for tv.

So it may be a case of you change your robot or miss out? the problem is, it would be far easier to all work together, as we all want the same goal, rather than loose some because they didnt want to evolve.

Does a TV series warrant people to change their robots? I dont know. Are people willing to evolve over time?

But unless someone tries well never know it may work, it may not.

Im going to be trying some ideas with my educational projects over the next few months, by getting the students to build robots for a multilevel feather weight arena and see how it goes.

I am encouranged by the positive vibe im getting in general though keep em coming.

John
http://www.RoamingRobots.co.ukwww.RoamingRobots.co.uk

Ohh this sounds like a fun computer modeling project for me :D

your very welcome to do it :)

Sure, Im for it, I will need some dimensions and limitations for the arena so I can scale it :)

Ill see what I can randomly generate so you can have a look to see if I can actually even make them, this is a first.

Thanks!
David

Robotica in my opinion took the emphasis too much on the gauntlet and maze. The fight to the finish was in a way to small an arena where if you can hold on till the walls dropped you could just push the opponent out (I hate pushouts).

For me the emphasis should stay with the fighting, not trying to outmanouvre the arena hazards and obstakels.

maybe true leo on second thoughts maybe it was a bit far fetched.

we shouldnt loose the fighting element... its what makes the events have a wow factor.


David, why dont you have a play and see what you can come up with.

john

someone made a good point earlier, the obstacles etc are good for roboteers, but is the general feeling with viewers is that they would rather want to see carnage? i dont know. as a roboteer and a viewer i would enjoy both lol...

i know when we did ukrg, the obsticle course was good when you were taking part, but could be very very boring at times to watch!!!

fighting is the best :)

i want to see kan opener against a spinner hehe

jonno, how fast has this year gone! its nearly april already :P

for rebel robots sake i hope ur wrong Jonno

i think its about presentation, the TV idea for Rebel Robots is not like it has been on tv before, its something new

We all jus want to fight so lets just fight leave the TV stuff to the TV people

Prehaps what lacked in the RW trials was the threat of a fight starting.

The most succesful trials in my eyes were the ones where as many machines as possible were taking part.

Then you could have either won by completing the trial or making sure no one else did.

there you go Mr Danby, your doing something new :) Not the old so it seams.

I dont think you can just leave the TV people to do what Tv people do, surely it has to be a two way street to provide the best entertainment, maybe im wrong.

Your providing a TV program, and Im providing a Live show. As we all know, when people went to see the filming of robot wars it was Very different to the finished article.

I would be interested to know how rebel robots is going to work..is it a live event being filmed, or is it a tv studio with a tight filming shedule?


John

Jonno i am the TV people ;)

Take the fight outside on some grass and have the drivers/audiance in the plastic box for a change. No floor damage and no flip outs.

so my friend mr tv people how is it working then?