Robot Design: Cyclone

Well, considering it does not actually exist, and only an idea, I don€™t think it belonged in Heavyweights section, considering its reality.

I€™m not sure if it will ever happen, and I€™m dependent on the BANK OF MUM at the moment still, but I do have a decent idea bout CAD, so Id like to show you Cyclone, an idea that€™s been in my head since I was 11.

Its a flipper robot, basically, its not got cool looks like Razer, Hypno-disc, Chaos 2, or Ming 3 million (:P), and its not probably going to exist at all, but all I can do is share my creation.

At first I started with this, from my simple drawing in Paint, I put it on the Pc, and found that the front was FAR too heavy in the weapon front. As we can see here, the forks were huge and the bars could probably not support it...

http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/5391/cyc11kp3nk4.pnghttp://img172.imageshack.us/img172/5391/cyc11kp3nk4.png

Then I had this stage, where the forks we gradiented to the body, but this caused the problem of that the forks could have a problem getting under something.

http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/3562/bout1el9.jpghttp://img172.imageshack.us/img172/3562/bout1el9.jpg

I then changed the final shape as a cue from Chaos 2, the front plate, so I changed to one of those and got rid of the ridiculas spines on the back, because that would cause self righting problems, as well as causing the actuators/rams to use unnecessary gas and carry weight.

http://www.ewe-squad.com/plei/Misc/Collage%201.jpghttp://www.ewe-squad.com/plei/Misc/Collage%201.jpg

Now your all wondering, whats with the Razer wings?.
Ill tell you, in Dantomkias fight against Firestorm in the All-Stars (I was 12/13 I think) I noticed the weakness that when against the wall, the flipper caused it to spin on the side, and land on its back again, should it be on the side by its flipper. So my solution was gained of the Razer bot, wings, which could help in tipping the balance so it lands on its feet of the side wall. (In Theory of course)

In all of that, please understand my age (15), and that Im not that clever with mechanics and mathematics, but I do get basic wiring and pneumatics, especially from studying Firestorm IV, Chaos 2 and of course Terrorhurtz.

That is a really cool design David, all three of them. Radical CADs, much better than my CADing skills, even at 18 I still bite at making CADs. :proud: On the third CAD, I can see how the Razer-esque wings would help in self-righting problems. Well thought-out. :)

As for not that clever with mechanics, LOL! Im not good with mechanics either, but Im still trying to make a featherweight. :proud:

The only thing I might point out is that Cyclone should have a rounded end so that it can self-right better. :)

Although with the amount of force that flippers produce these days, it probably would even touch the end during self-righting - would probably do a 540 degree spin or something (ok, maybe not as much as that but still.....:))

Nice looking bot David, hope youre able to get it from the drawing board to the arena one day - good luck!

Nice CADs David, that machine looks mean.

Like Jamie said, actually building it would be cooler. If you havent got the resources for that though, you can also give a ough description of how youre gonna build it and enter it in some of the fictional competitions that can be found here :proud:

It does look nice. What weight class are you intending to make it for? For your first machine, its probably better to make it a featherweight, as theyre not as budget-intensive as a heavyweight would be. I believe feathers also have the most competition at the moment, although I could be wrong there.

Thanks guys. Im glad you like the design. Im going to ask about for various parts like metal sheets, is George Francis still living in Ipswich?

I want to mail em a letter to see if theres any of those H5 controllers going about from Gt Electronics.

Ill also need a VERY small C02 gas bottle, and stuff. I might be able to get some motors from Technobots.

I hope to make this a Featherweight bot, Im gonna carry on with the 3d so I can get a good idea of these things and the layout. Im also gonna make a few blueprints I hope so I can make better sense of it.

W00t, this MAY be real yet.

(Message edited by David B on March 10, 2007)

Thats a seriously cool looking bot, nice CAD work. Reminds me of Mute a little bit with the shape and barbs on the top.

Good luck with building it if your going to. If you ask around people will be able to help you lot with getting a pneumatic system sorted out. Hope to see it around some day, it seems like a pretty dceent design.

To answer your questions, Ive not seen the Chaos team around for a long long while. There are plenty of places you can pick up materials, so dont worry about that. If your on a restricted budget, then polycarbonate is handy as well and you can get it pretty cheap. If you look in the for sale thread you might just pick up some bargains.

I beleive GT Electronics have a website somewhere where you can order speedos, but I highly recommend going for either the IBC or SideWinder controllers if they are affordable. If not, Id suggest using the Electronise ones. H5 are a bit out dated these days I beleive.

CO2 bottles can be found plenty of places round here. Mario can do you some full pneumatics fairly cheap as a whole set if thats what your looking for. If your starting basic you could even try a compressor system.

Featherweights are a great way to start out. You can get plenty of help with building them, and they are pretty cool little things. Myself, Ive been out of the scene for a while so Im not so up to date, but Ive built my own featherweight and I hope I can help whenever I can. Just get in touch with me if you need and help. :)

Good luck!

Thats great information AJ, Ill look into those controllers too. Its a little hard to get info, becuase no one updates thier sites anymore, ever since RW went off Air, sites have just been left in sudden stops.

Thanks for the offer of help with pneumatics, if I need help, Ill ask here.:)

UPDATE DESIGN:
Now I added a pair of motors and also I added a new Canister position, I got up close to the motors and wheel to get a look at them better. Also, Ill probably change th motors to indirect powering, as in, gearbox possibly, so that the bot does not go at 200 MPH around anything. :P

http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/856/cyclonegh5.jpghttp://img183.imageshack.us/img183/856/cyclonegh5.jpg

As I said tommorow, Im gonna go about and see if I cna find some THIN sheet metals, or polycarbonate, considering you mentioned it.

(Message edited by David B on March 10, 2007)

Glad I can be of some help. Just out of interest, do you actually have motors or batteries yet?

Correct me if Im wrong, but in the CAD it looks like you are using SLA batteries and some sort of wiper motors for drive. If you already have these, then go ahead. But again, if your budget allows you too, go for some NiCad of NiMH batteries and some cordless drill motors. Youd be surpried how much weight and space you can save and devote to thicker armour or a better pneumatics system.

Its all costly, but it does pay off in the end. Have a look around Technobots for some better batteries. I highly recomend cordless drill motors, otherwise you will need to go about building your own gearbox and finding a way of securing your wheels to the shaft.

Do you have an approximate budget to work to? If so it would probably give us a better understanding of what you can afford. I ended up spending probably close to £700 on a basic rambot and that was with all the metalwork done for free.

looks very nice - If your realy thinking of making it as a feather, check out the gimson robotics store for a very cheap and reliable drive system with cordless drills. http://www.gimsonrobotics.comwww.gimsonrobotics.com i think. They are in the robot kit section.

Great infor guys, perhaps you may help me, Im NOT completely aware of EXACTLY what I may need, perhaps a technical list of what others use may come in handy, as in a full list of PARTS in the bot, or maybe some diagrams of how some of your bots work.

My mum wants a full list of the stuff before I she will even attempt to gather the parts I require.

So maybe some complete lists of what youi use, may help me to get my parts.

(btw, anyone know where I can get some Featherweight size RAMS from EXCEPT E-BAY?)

Thanks for all the great help!

(Message edited by David B on March 11, 2007)

As for having anything, I dont at the moment, Im waiting to have a pretty solid design, then I can order parts from Technobots and vairous places.

Okay, you will obviously need more than this list if your doing a pneumatics set up, but I dont fully undertand all the components needed so Ill just give the basics...

Radio Gear (transmitter and receiver) - most people use the Futaba controllers you can get from Technobots but you can get alternatives such as wheel controllers if you like
Materials of some sort - you can pick up some polycarb from Technobots, otherwise I cant help much with metals
Wheels - anything will do, but the RoboChallenge blue wheels are very good and screw right onto the drill thread with ease
Motors (prferably drill motors) - you can get cordless drill motors from any DIY shop or GimsonRobotics sell some ready prepared ones if you dont want to spend hours dismantling and preparing them
Wire - from Technobots, make sure you dont get the really thin stuff though
Crimps (or connector blocks if you cant afford them) these just connect your wires, pretty cheap from Technobots
Batteries - depends on your budget, SLA if you have weight room and a limited budget but NiCad/NiMH if your going for smaller, lightweight but more pricey alternatives, from Technobots
Speed controller (Electronize, IBC, SideWinder) - depends on your price range, Electronize are very basic, cheap and available in the UK while IBC are Australian and SideWinder are American if you want to import (these 2 are also much more expensive but have by far better features)
Cooling fan (optional) - just in case, I just blow a fan onto my IBC so that the fets dont burn out, they are pretty cheap and its better to be safe than sorry... fans are certainly cheaper than speedo repairs

Thats all I can think of at the moment. For your flipper you will want some rams, a canister and stuff like that which add to the weight and price. I have no experience in pneumatics so its better to ask elsewhere.

Hi Dave,

You might want to post in the Featherweight section if your looking at building it, a lot more builders read that section of the forums then this one :proud:

AJ has drafted out a good parts list there. Although, I would make a suggestion on getting a Spektrum DX6 radio. Drill motors are a good, cheap source of drive motors, but if you over volt them, try to stay within 150% voltage (ie: 12v motors on 18v is 150%).

Pneumatics can be a pretty dangerous weapon, so your best off starting at low pressure (145psi) and spend a few months talking with those who run pneumatic featherweights. Their advice and experience will help you time and time again :)

Cool robot, Dave!

If you want it built that badly, dont give up on it. Ive had one on my mind for 5 years and it still isnt finished. getting close, though.

Learn to Blag. If youve got guts, you could ask different companies to sponsor you parts. The FRA guide to sponsorship is at
http://www.extremefightingmachines.co.uk/Guide_to_Sponsorship.pdfhttp://www.extremefightingmachines.c...ponsorship.pdf. This may help if have a LP pneumatic set-up as a lot of industrial pneumatics uses the same pressure.

Practice driving. Often this will make or break a battle.

If anyone is in doubt, remind them this is a multi discipline engineering challenge. Mechanical, Electrical, Broadcast and, hell, even special effects engineers had a go at this and they still lost. It is still probably the best vehicle for engineering the world has and is not getting the attention it deserves. A crying shame in my eyes.

Parts wise youll want:

as AJ said above
Note the most expensive points in this are the radio kit (40MHZ FM/2.4GHZ are the main accepted and legal frequencies. 40 Mhz kit will require you to carry 3 pairs of tuned crystals for a fractional frequency), the speed controller (as its customised for the application, combat is a sure way to kill an RC speedo!) and the batteries (it is easy to spend too much on this for very little improvement!)

If I were you, Id use an 18V cordless drill set up for the drive. Itll be straight forward, less hassle and quite fast. Remember floor grip when choosing your wheel/mounting your drive, though.

You may also want to leave the shell and flipper being custom built by one of the companies in the FRAs commercial adverts forum. Be insistant, though. Youre the boss.

LP Pneumatics parts:
Main Bottle, Dump valve, Regulator, Buffer (Optional), Control valves(1 piece), Ram(s) as far as Im aware, though for safety reasons, more devices may be added.

If you follow the next link to design and the bottom of the page, youll see a working pneumatic system in flash animation.
http://www.teamfirestorm.co.uk/index2.htmhttp://www.teamfirestorm.co.uk/index2.htm
John Reids (Killerhurtz) pneumatics page
http://howto.killerhurtz.co.uk/pneumatics.htmhttp://howto.killerhurtz.co.uk/pneumatics.htm
Alan Woody Woods (Onslaught) pages
http://www.teamonslaught.fsnet.co.uk/pneumatics.htm%20%20http://www.teamonslaught.fsnet.co.uk/pneumatics.htm

(Message edited by Psychostorm on March 14, 2007)

Brilliant information from ya guys/girls? The diagrams on Terrorhurtz are very cool CAD designs. :)

You wont notice here, that I connected my regulator directly to my bottle for now, hahahah. :P

http://www.ewe-squad.com/plei/Cyclone/RB1.jpghttp://www.ewe-squad.com/plei/Cyclone/RB1.jpg

Ok, so I noticed some exposures I didnt want in the bot, and I had changed the look a little.

The lift supports were curved, and I didnt like this in comparison to the body. Also, the front panel for the flipper was far too short, and just didnt give enough surface area to hit. Another thought I had was to make it provide a little more protection for the wings, so I made either side have a sharp flail.

The wings also now have something to pivot on, and they are much more ridged to fit with the rest of the arm. I also noticed that a robot like this would be better on four smaller wheels rather than two large ones (agree?).

http://www.ewe-squad.com/plei/Cyclone/bot7.jpghttp://www.ewe-squad.com/plei/Cyclone/bot7.jpg