Hobbyweights anyone?

I know this is the featherweight part of the forum but this seemed the most appropriate place to post this.

I was surfing around some american websites when I came accross hobbyweights. The basically have all the same american rules with the weight limit being set at 12pounds. I liked the look of that so I decided to give it a try. I looked around a few websites and saw that people were using drill motors for drive and around 2000mah batteries. I liked the look of that and I also had a lot of spare parts around so currently I am building one.

The biggest problem I have is the weight. 12pounds is 5.443108kg. Now I cannot decide what weight limit we should use over here. First I thought 5.5kg but then I thought well thats slightly over the limit so maybe 5kg. The after some Instant messanger conversations with a few people (you know who you are) the surgestion of 6kg was made. Personally I dont mind. I reckon I could build a robot to any of those weight limits but the reasons for 6kg are at present the best. Its Half a Featherweight!

What are peoples opinions of this? I am currently recomending that we use the FRA rules (including a power light) and Perhaps a 6kg limit. I will hopefully finnish the hobby weight very soon as I have nothing to do until my polycarb arrives for the Featherweight.

Would anyone else be intrested in building a Hobbyweight?

Please post your opinions here

Regards
Ian

I might be interested. I had a go at building a featherweight recently with drill motors and the whole thing weighed in at just over 3kg, without any weapons so I could resurrect it for a 6kg class.

I think at the lower weight limit you would probably be looking at fights which are less of a spectator sport and more of, well, a hobby, as the name suggests.

At this weight limit it may be practical to convert some of the larger remote control toy cars to FRA spec, which would make it more accesible.

A few Hobbyweights use cordless screwdrivers over volted to 12v with good results.

If you dont think that the hobbyweights will draw the crowds, go to: http://www.teamcosmos.comwww.teamcosmos.com and look at Xenophobia. Xenophobia is a very sweet machine and packs quite a punch.

Yeah i think i might give it a go, Ive seen how the Americans do it and it can be fun. Ill keep you posted if i go ahead with the bot or bots.

Chris - http://www.featherweights.org/forum

The Germans have a simular weightclass running, the Raptors, 5.4 kg.

I myself dont like another weightclass. The lightweights and middleweights dont get that much attention.And in the Netherlands the Feathers are in progress, but the heavies are the main part of the fun at the moment.

Not another weight class. Deary me.
Na well - if a couple of you build them, then you can team up and form a Feather Weight cluster bot and fight the feather weights also. hehe.
One thing that jumped out at me -
Now I cannot decide what weight limit we should use over here - not for you to decide Ian.

Good luck, never know, i may build one in the summer if these kick off.

Mr Stu

Id rather have a kilobot (1kg) class than hobbyweight really... beacuse at 6kg you cant scavenge most of the parts from an RC car...

dont the americans have a 1kg weight class aswell? I believe its called the bug or beetle class. Although we have to watch that we dont create too many weight classes as this would lead to the FRA and roboteering community becoming overstretched.

I would like to see more attention given to lightweights and middleweights though because there is a big gap between heavies and feathers, both of which are good but I think it would be good to try and encourage competition in these other current weight categories.

Rc Wars have been running a 6kg class for 4 years. But there are things in the pipline at the moment so i would surgest not to commence building just yet as there maybe an official 5kg weight class if things go well

Well really at the moment the weight classes that have mass appeal are..

AntWeight (150g) FeatherWeight (12Kg) HeavyWeight (100Kg)
There is big gaps between them all but the other less publicised classes are ....

FleaWeight (75g)
Super AntWeight (250g ?)
Kilobot (1Kg)
LightWeights
MiddleWeights

Chris - http://www.featherweights.org/forum

Now I cannot decide what weight limit we should use over here - not for you to decide Ian.

Stu thats what my post says I cannot Decide the weight limit that can be used.

I am going to build one to a 5kg limit which means that if the weight limit is raised i have more weight to put on. I will hopefully be travelling to newark so I should hopefully have my feather and Hobby ready for then.

Regards
Ian

Rc Wars was origionally 6kg robots, if anyone saw PloughBot at its first major showing in wrexham rumble that was 6kg with a 5kg steel shell bolted ontop to keep up the weight.
6kg are very easy to build and yet very competative.
Team Rc Wars currently have 5 6kg robots either made or in the making, including flippers, FBS. pushers and axes.
We have had some very impressive ideas tested with ploughbots chassis and another super pusher is going to be built, and should even be very competative against featherweight robots.

My personal opinion is that if 100kg robots top the bill, middleweights are 1/2 that at 50 kg, 1/2 that at 25kg are lightweights, 1/2 again is the 12kg feathweights (give or take), and 1/2 that should be 6kg robots, call them what you like.

As james and grant have said, RcWars has successfully run 6 kg robots for 4 years, and continues to do so. If the weight decided on is 6 kg, there are 5 (potentially 11) robots ready to go, if its 5kg, maybe one or 2 can be modified to get into the weight, but I dont think it would be worth the expense at this time.

If brought up as a proposed weight calss at an FRA meeting Id vote for 6kg, but if its not brought up Im not too bothered as we have been using this calss without problem for so long it wont reall yeffect us anyway.

class.... class.... how did I get that wrong twice?

I will build them and fight them whatever anyone says, and if there is no official 6kg weight class set, then whoever would like to build one is welcome to fight them at Rc Wars at any event we hold, we have lots of them and will hope to see more.
Thanks
Grant

Id say 6kg- using jamess logic. Im definatelly up for building one- same technology (give or take) as feather but hopefully just cheaper.

I can see the Mag Motor coming into it.
Can we set a rule - no Ed Hoppits allowd?

Mr Stu

LOL...
Why dont we have an RC cars class... I couldnt really see Ed driving a Lem powered, CNCd RC car :)

i dont like the name hobbyweights sounds iffy.

Mr Stu

Be very careful about introducing new weight classes to the game.

Whilst it might sound like a great idea to add extra weight classes, the more classes you add, the fewer people youll have building in each.

The UK has things worked out fairly well, Heavies and Feathers being the most popular with Middles and Ants following along.

To introduce extra weight classes will most certainly dilute the number of people building in each weight class. The question that needs to be asked - is that good for the sport ? Im firmly against fragmentation of the weight classes beyond what we have already, and dont see what a 6Kg class would add to the sport ?

What I do see is fewer robots of one weight class being built, which can only be a bad thing.

Seriously, think about it.

Ed
http://www.teamstorm.comhttp://www.teamstorm.com

Weve been here before with ants and fleas. If theres sufficient interest, and there seems to be, there shouldnt be too much of a problem. Certainly accross the pond they have a very happy balance between 30lbs and 12lbers, and most smaller weight class team have both types of bot. Equally, they have a plethora of small weight class events which seem to work. Im willing to give it a try- its not so much a new weight class for the sake of it as filling a bit of a hole.

I will be willing to give it a try possibly the forum admin could make a thread on the main page for all new weight classes eg.hobby,light and fleaweights?

I think were more after an initial show of hands to see if anyones interested. Theres no harm in asking :-)

i dont like the name hobbyweights sounds iffy.

Mr Stu I only put that name down as thats what the weight class is called in the US I am sure that it could be changed for over here.

Regards
Ian

Sorry Guys,
I think Im going to have to side with Ed on this one.
Remember that the US has a MUCH higher population then the UK. So proportionaly there are far more roboteers and events, thus the scope for more weight classes.
My team for example has a heavy & feather but we certainly dont have the time to construct, maintain and fight an ant, light or middle let alone a super ant, hobby, kilo or whatever other weight.
I think it would definatly dilute and fragment our sport/hobby if these new weight classes were introduced, let alone the problems of trying to arrange a one or even two day event to cover all the existing PLUS these new classes.
My two pennies anyway.
Geoff.

If you think about the way events are run in Britan at the moment, heavies are the main attraction, featherweights are mostly used to fill in (although they are getting more recognised) and antweights sometimes have to do their fighting at lunchtime when there are no spectators at all. If we add more weight classes they will start fighting for arena time/frequencies and things may go sour.

Just my humble (drunken) opinion

Joe Townsend

Well ants really dont get treated well at most events and it is true that feathers are sometimes a fill in but I dont think you can stop anyone building a machine to a 5kg or 6kg weight limit. It might not be officially recognised but then ants were not officially recognised until series 3 or 4 but they began to be built long before then. I am going to build one regardless (everything is on the workbench and the technobots order for more polycarb is soon to be sent). If i have nobody else to fight well then thats life if I do then great!

Also there are alot of weight classes around antweights but antweights have still not lost many members to otehr simular weight classes. E.g. I currently have a flea and ant and a superant.

This may not become an official class but then just because its not official does not mean people cant or wont build them.

Regards
Ian

Who said you cant build them. Build a 300kg robot if you like, just there isnt a weight class for it to fight at a live event. Ian just chill a bit for god sake before you hurt ya self. Im sure live events will accomadate for a weight class to have arena time if there are a lot of them. But sadly most events are having to turn into a crowd pleaseing role, even more so now Robot Wars is no longer on Channel 5 of BBC2. To keep the public in the eye, shows have to use big robots. The crowd and JUST be pleased with a load of Feather Weights in the arena at once. Soon as 2 feathers enter the arena in front of a big crowd, it becomes BORING! And thats coming from a kid who was involved with Feathers from day one! No one has said you cant build a 5kg robot, and no one ever will.

Mr Stu

Hey, far be it for me to stop anyone bulding anything. I was only trying to point out the potential problems if these weights were to be made official. The only thing I would ask is whatever you build, please build and fight it safely. Im quite sure that some of the existing FRA saftey guidelines can be addapted for these new weights.
Good luck,
Geoff

We all knew thats what you meant Geoff, dont worry mate. And im sure Ian and others will try and adopt the FRA rules. Already ian has shown hes going to try and add a power light to his robot.

Mr Stu

I have to agree with Ed n Geoff really... if there are too many weight classes, itll not only dilute the number of robots in each class, but it will confuse the lot of us...
Imagine RW showing 4-5 weight classes in a show, Itd just confuse the viewers...

There is a limit on the weight classes that are visually exciting to watch. I personally think featherweights are the mimimum weight that viewers will take an intrest to (with anything below feather being much less visually exciting).

If we all end up having more robot it would cost us more money... And the quality of our robots could be diluted as we spend less time on each one... (remember, time x money = robot).

Cheers, Ewan

I agree these 5-6kg bots might not be a crowd pleaser but that does not nessassarly (spelling)mean that we cannot run them. I am sure that at sometime during the day (before the first show, lunch time, after the show) there will be a time when the arena is free and we could use it.

Regards
Ian

Normal lunch time means lunch time. You dont know how hard it is to run an event, then lunch time comes, you just want to sit down and not worry about the arena. Someone needs to be at the arena at all times, they do need a lunch break Ian. Just build your 5-6kg robot and stop complaining. We cant stop you, nor would anyone try, stop making a big thing of it.

Mr Stu

Rc Wars runs regular roboteer social events where people come along and socialise with other builders. they bring there featherweights along to have a few battles.

if there are a few 5/6kg machines then il organise somthing and set up the Rc Wars arena for you to play in. if it gets big enough we could hold some sort of championship?

Stu i am currently building the bot and I am not trying to make a big thing of it. I am not going to get into an arguement about it. I will be bringing it to newark regardless of whether i can run it or not.

Regards
Ian

LOL ok Ian, chill chill chill. LOL.

Mr Stu

mmm...
One of the reasons America can afford to have so many bloody weight classes is there are so many people building over the pond... Just see this: a Database of US bot builders: http://www.buildersdb.com/search_robots.asp?BotName=&x=16&y=0&TeamName=&Clas sID=&City=&State=http://www.buildersdb.com/search_rob...Name=&ClassID= &City=&State= (and thats not all of em:))
Cheers, Ewan

I think that anyone thinking of building a 6kg robot, just go ahead and do it. I have read and understood all of the points put across above, and my opinion is, featherweights are expensive.

Though Ed rightly says that further diluting the weight classes is bad, how many roboteers will abandon their feathers or heavies to build weeny-weights? (since hobbyweight is dodgey)

Also, how many potential roboteers have looked at feathers and thought... man, my rc car isnt powerful enough for that class

In short, if you build them we will come..... with our arena, and as there is likely to be a heavyweight event every 5 minutes the way things are going, this may be the best chance feather and weenyweights will have of actually fighting without worrying about heavies nicking their place in the arena.

As weve said, weve done it for years, join us if you wish, officially recognized or not.

AAAAARRRGGGHHHH. Just stop all this shite about its not entertaining for the public to watch and it will dilute the other classes
If you want to build one build one, i have and still will, i still run my feather as often as i can, no one has noticed me dropping a feather for my 6kg bots have they. NO....
Who cares what the public think about small weight classes, I dont and if thats all you lot think about then thats your tuff shit, because building and fighting robots is my hobby, and its what i enjoy, and if all you care about is who will find it interesting to watch i think your in the wrong business.
I think you will all agree that the fun in building robots is to see them evolve and to see what is cabable with limited weights, respurces etc....
Anyone wishing to build 6kg robots or already have built them, contact Rc Wars and we will gladly sort you out, if its no official weoght class what does it matter? We can still have rules and regulations, competitions etc. and still have fun doing it.

thanks, Grant

Ahhhh........

Who cares what the public think about small weight classes, I dont and if thats all you lot think about then thats your tuff shit, because building and fighting robots is my hobby, and its what i enjoy, and if all you care about is who will find it interesting to watch i think your in the wrong business

As ever, a reasoned argument from one of the Coopers.

This is a public forum Grant, our fans come here (yes, theyre the public) and read this. Do you want to tell them you dont believe we should care if they find what we do interesting and that if we do were in the wrong business ?

Who cares what the public think ?... Well Ill stick my hand in the air and say I do. Theyre the lifeblood of what we do, as any spectator based sport is. If you dont need to care about what they want or alienate them with attitudes that you dont give a sh*t about them, and you can kiss this sport goodbye :sad:

Ed
http://www.teamstorm.com