Build Rules 2011

well it's just evolution isn't it? Survival of the fittest.

Under the current setup it is beneficial to either build a spinner, rammer or flipper simply because those are the strongest machines in the arena. It's been a long while since a walker came along and I've never heard of a hovercraft, unlikely to win. Crushers and axes, the limiting factor is the weight. There just isn't enough weight in the category to allow construction of machines that will get through the tops of current machines.

Change the environmental conditions and the type of machine that is top dog might well change. :)

Maybe adding some variation in height to arenas would be a more organic way of increasing ground clearance...I know Dragon*Con Robot Battles (strange source I know :P) in the US does that, they have raised strips to prevent ground-hugging wedges and seem to get a decent variety of designs (although it's also a non-spinner event due to being on an unwalled stage)

prevents crushers being low then aswell, So it makes it so theres no point having ground clearance rule because every robot will be the same hight.

I totally agree with you Gary, it is turning around to be a fight of the fittest and spinners & ram bots seem to be the way forward. They are the easiest machine to build and the most effective.

What i am saying is do we really want this? do we really want to lose all these other robots? If no then we need to evolve the rules as people will only build them if they are competitive. I really don't want to see them disappear however unless something changes its the road we are going down. So who wants to see changes to bring these bots back into the competition?

At the moment who is building a new robot for the UK Champs that isnt a rambot or a spinner? we know of asgard.

The Seraph weighs 13.6kg has armour between 8mm and 3mm (yes 3mm) HDPE and A ground clearance of about 120mm and won the annihilator comp! dose it have an active weapon?
It went up against spinners when other robots ran away! watch the videos.
I am against any changes in the rules as it could stifle the very diversity it is trying to promote, I would say keep the build rules open. But change the fighting environment, if you want to stop ground hugging weapon-less slugs like Tron put a step in the arena floor, then those with good ground clearance have an advantage. or limit the number of any type from entering the competition, you could have a maximum of 10 ram-bots they fight it out for these places before the main event.

Lets keep thinking :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

Craig

In my personal opinion i would say that Seraph does have an active weapon.

As we are witnessing the current rules aren't encouraging a variety or any diversity of robots to be built. A step in the floor would simply be a hazard to everyone. I believe we need to evolve the rules to make machines like axes and crushers competitive other wise people wont build them. If no changes are made we will end up with the same outcome as america. bricks v spinners and its killing their sport. come on guys.

Please note i do not want any kind of robot banned, I am simply trying to produce rules to encourage diversity and variety.

Two further points jump to mind.

- James, your arena is the only that can contain spinners. Therefore it follows suit that a fair number of spinners are going to enter any competition (I know I'm guilty of this one!)

- As crushers aren't effective in the featherweight class, it requires a bit of smart engineering to make an effective bot with such a weapon. Mantis is one that jumps to mind, never had to crush, just clamped and lifted opponents. There was another machine in robot wars, can't remember its name though. It had two horizontal arms that came from the side and clamped onto it's opponent. Got the front torn off by hypnodisc.

We have a few options to make it more likely that more diverse machines will be created,

- Limit the number of a type of machine that can compete in a championship. If more turn up (ie 4 spinners allowed, 6 turn up) then have an in fight to determine the champ contenders
- Modify the rules specifically for the weapons to be encouraged. Additional weight for axes and crushers? Some kind of limit to other weapon types?
- Change the environment to allow different machines to compete, already been turned down.

Obviously some of these rules would cause more agro than others. Mind you a walking axe bot would be rather interesting to say the least :)

Interesting discussion,

I€™ve just seen some of the fights on you tube, looks like the spinners are really coming on !

Have you considered raising the height of your walls... it looks like the spinners have now become reliable however can€™t stay inside the arena. Why not give them a bit more of a chance

The flippers still have an easy ride really as it doesn€™t take much to flip something out over the wall.

If Clive is right, 3 flippers not entered because you had it on a Friday in term time, I wanted to have entered a flipper if I wasn€™t busy making robots for the BBC, your crusher never gets entered, 1 axe not finished and 1 axe didn€™t turn up, I€™d say there is the variety there, maybe just not this year due to circumstances.

I€™ve always been a NON FAN of boxes, however as has just been proved, a hardox box with a scoop driven well can be a champion, so I don€™t see how you can ban it, or should penalise it !! It may not be that entertaining, but damn effective !!

I€™m not really a fan of crushers either though, from an entertainment point of view they are IMHO boring as you don€™t see the actual destruction, you just see a hole, but its the speed controller or motors which have been damaged, i€™d much prefer to see an axe bashing something, and I think so would the audience !!
But a 13.6kg axe robot is never going to produce enough power to even scratch hardox or Ti !

I think people will still build diverse robots for entertainment, but when its full combat, its a different story, its the nature of robotic combat !

John
Roaming Robots

Firstly I think we should understand the chances of the rules being changed in the way discussed, ram bots 12kg limit, knowing the game politic, are slim to none.
As they would mean we move away from the international rule set. and someone some were would complain.

But the arena is not under this constraint, if some floor panels were raised 10mm say in a chequered pattern, then robots would have to be able to accommodate this.

Tron (my robot) would not be able to run in this arena with out serious modification Tiny Toon would probably not have won the UK champs,

Not being a Darwinian it is hard for me to use his theories as an example but here goes,

If you change the environment you change the direction of evolution.

Crushers would not be any good at this weight as the amount of force required would be too much for this weight class Axes and hammers fine, walkers are another thing I would make a walker but the weight advantage off only 150% is no good. but I might still have a go!!!

Keep thinking :mrgreen:

Craig

2.2.
Legged Robots [Walkers] can weigh up to twice the specified weight in all classes. A
walker must employ moveable legs to support its weight. Robots with rolling or sliding
mechanisms will not be classified as walkers.