I think you mean electronize 40A and yes they last forever, still got a pair that are around 5 years old that work fine.
Nylon for bulkheads (10 or 12mm) and hdpe for armour, 8mm will stand up to most spinners but 6mm will do you fine
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I think you mean electronize 40A and yes they last forever, still got a pair that are around 5 years old that work fine.
Nylon for bulkheads (10 or 12mm) and hdpe for armour, 8mm will stand up to most spinners but 6mm will do you fine
As mentioned, the best bet that can at least guarantee successful running of four drill motors is the Electronize range. Specifically you'd be wanting two of the 30A units that can be modified by having their internal relays replaced with some bigger external relays rated at 40A which helps ensure that your controllers are less likely to be damaged from being over-stressed.
Technobots used to offer this product (the speed controller with a pair of external relays and any modifications necessary) but due to lack of demand they do not stock them anymore. You would have to contact Electronize directly (http://www.electronize.com) and ask if they could supply you with modified controllers. They don't provide the larger 40A relays though, you would have to buy them yourself. You can get them from Maplin or Technobots:
http://www.technobots.co.uk/acatalog/On ... s_360.html
(the 12V ones, and you would need two per controller, so four in total for full robot drive)
I will admit though, depending on how tight your budget is, that this option isn't necessarily cheap. I believe you'd be looking in the region of £100 for both controllers and relays. But Christmas is coming up, so let Santa know what you're after :wink:
If I stretched to say £150 would there be anything good that I could use straight out the box and would last?
i'd go for the controller i suggested early i think the controller will be able to deal with 4 drills
pm sent
im not ging to look at prices for these controlers :P , but for more high end stuff heres my recommendations. 2 Victors ( ask razor dave ) , a sabertooth 25 A ??? (might it handl eit just about ?). or have a look at the vantec. Or one of the 50 quid wotys would do what you want i think (or are they 100 quid ?).
And yeh i ment 40 A electronize :P , 40 A sabertooth , i can dream :lol: .
Hi I think you mean the Wotty100 I have put in an order with Ian and the price is £190 each
Bargin they will handle almost the same amps as a sidewinder (I had one of those in a heavyweight.) :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
Cheers guys, im tempted by the electronize 40A but i think im going to try the XXL and hope it work unless anyone says otherwise before rick mails me back.
If i did swap and go for the electronize how hard is tht mod to do?
to swap speed controllers is merely a case of disconnecting and reconnecting a few wires (depending on your robot design)
Modifying the electronize to take 40A is a bit more tricky but if you have a decent soldering iron and some experience soldering it will only take a few hours to do.
Or, failing that, I'm sure someone on this forum would be happy to mod them for you, either for free or a small fee.
I would offer, but I should be busy studying right now and I don't have 100% confidence in performing a mod like that on someone else's components. Plus when I received mine, they were already modded so all I had to do was crimp some spade terminals on to the wires and connect them up to the relays.
In regards to the XXL, I've not used that (or the XL) myself but I seem to remember that the XL is 12.5A per channel and the commercial XXL is 25A per channel. Whether Rick's mods make his XXLs 25A I do not know, but personally I still wouldn't be too confident with using one to control four drills.
Apologies if all these opinions are confusing you as to which controller to go for. The Electronize option will work, but that's the only one I can say based on my personal use and experience.
i really think you might aswell get a dual controller i find the elctronize a real pain and found it so much easier once i was on a different controller
if we are talking about overkill i used an rs80d with 2 drills :crazy: but it was intended for the speed 900s
I have found with Tron (a 4 drill feather robot) the Sabertooth 25A per channel did not work very well, I never used it in a fight it was that bad!
The drills were 9.4v over-volted to 14.4V, In the end I fitted the Sidewinder (75A per channel) this stopped all the messing about. :uhoh: :uhoh: :uhoh:
You can go about in circles with all of this, if you want a reliable speed controller it has to be over spec and expensive. :shock: :shock:
how much is a sidewinder and do they sell them in the uk or do i have to get one from abroad?
We used to run Whirlpool with 4, 12v drills running at 15.6v on a single scorpion XL (with 2 small fans for cooling).
When we changed to 18v motors we added an extra Scorpion XL using one for each side.
Eventually we put a sidewinder in there (only because we are using the XLs in Heatwave and Whirlwind) and it has run without any problems at all.We got ours from http://www.robotmarketplace.com
Heres a quick video of Whirlpool when it ran with 4, 12v motors on a single Scorpion XL (it ran like this for almost 2 years without any problems)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lo5dafd-MGg
Yeah getting slightly confussing but you recon the XXL should run 4 motors fine also, or do u recon id be best getting 2x XL or is it really worth making a bit of an investment and getting a sidewinder
Speed controllers are the most expensive part in most robots, my experience of the Sabertooth is not a good one, but it could be I just had a duff unit (it€™s back in the USA at the moment being fixed!!)
Sidewinders I think my unit was £275, Sabertooth was £92 and Wotty100 £190.
But I think I will be the first to be using this unit in a feather when it comes next week, the wotty100 is a new design, so I am expecting some teething problems with it and so can€™t recommend it at the moment, but I think it will be the new standard for feather speed controllers soon.
I would suggest you get the best quality unit you can. :D
If you use 4 12V motors, and Will could run his setup on an XL, then the XXL should certainly be able to handle it.Quote:
Originally Posted by zoll
But, it is a bit like comparing apples and oranges really. No 2 brands of drill motors are alike so what works for one set might not work on another set, and what works on 12V might not work on 14.4V or 18V or 24V.
Sidewinders are a more robust option, but more expensive. The Wotty 100 might be an option though not tested in the field yet.
seeing as a saberooth 10 A willl run 2 drill motors over volted to 14.4 V just dandy , you could use 2 ) 1 on the front 2 motors and 1 on the back 2 ) and then use 2 y leads to connect both the inputs togehtor , no soldering and it comes in at about 90 quid :).
wheres the cheapest place to get a sidewinder as i take it tht will defo work and will allow me to use it for other things in the future
i belive you get them new from th us and yes these can be used with heavies
cheers, just waiting for reply from grant but does anyone know how bit the blue wheels are nd how easy they are to attach?
The two main sizes of blue wheels used are 75mm and 100mm. They are also available in 63mm and 120mm and sizes upwards of that I believe. When it comes to attaching them, if they've got a nut fitted into the centre of the wheel it is simply a case of screwing the wheel directly on to the output shaft of the drill motor. As a securing method, the reverse-threaded screw that comes with the drill that holds the chuck on can be screwed back in with a washer on it to stop the wheel unscrewing.
Quite simple and allows for relatively straight-forward maintenance.
you will also want to look into some way of mounting the drill motors , this often overlooked but very important for a reliable bot.
Grant (robochallenge) can also supply the drill mounting kits
Excellent, just waiting to hear back from him, doesnt appear to have been online in the last week. Any idea how much the wheels and the mounting kits cost?
i have never bought the mounting kits
and the wheels vary depending on size
roughly : 75 mm ar a fiver , 100 mm are £6 and 125 are £7 , add another pound per wheel for the nuts melted in (which you will need) . so for 100 mm wheels , itd be £28 for a 4wd bot like yours , there worth the monies. No idea how much the mounting kits are.
Cool just need to wait for Grant to get back to me on them then. Below is a list of bits that ive decided on and those which I am still undecided.
Motors: 4 drill motors (2 already bought and dismantled)
Speed Controller: Sidewinder (looking at buying in the next week or so)
Body: HDPE (also looking to order in the next week)
Batteries: (going to use those of the drill, does this sound alright for a start?)
TX & RX (looking at the DX5 but not sure on this atm, any comments?)
Weapon: Axe (where can I find information of the a design for this?)
Thanks again as always for all your help :D
If you're opting for an electric axe, this article sheds a bit of light on the basics of an electric axe. Obviously axes don't have to be made exactly like this one but it should give an insight into the process/parts required:
http://www.robowars.org/wikka/ElectricAxeWeapons
And that same robot a couple of evolutions later:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fl1cOdXizC8
i think the dx5 is good but never used it before the planet 5 is a cheaper option which a few people are very pleased with for about £40
the batteries you can make them work but you can buy some cheap nimhs off ebay which will last much longer, thi would mean you would need a different charger (not sure if you are planning on using the drill charger for those batts?) i have a multi charger which can handle many different types of batteries with lots of other functions (let me know if interested)
alex
If i bought batteries off ebay, how many would i need for 4 drill motors and what would i be looking for? If i did go this route I would be interested in your charger but what kinda price are we talking?
ok 2 of these would do fine
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/7-2v-NiMH-3700mAh ... 3357365ba0
this shop/seller has been very helpful to me and loads of other roboteers
the charger new would be £75 but mine is used but in good condition and comes with box and instructions and all the leads, (btw this is the type you can just plug into a wall socket)
i would be looking for £50 however i have said to someone else that they are welcome to buy it but i will contact them to see what they say and repost later
let me know if interested
alex
I would need 4 or 8 for 4 motors? and yeah if hes not interested let me know
2 would be fine, 7.2 V batteries n series make 14.4 V , an ideal voltage for a 12 V drill motor.
im running 12 volt drill motors on 14.4 volts on 100cm blue wheels and its a really nice nippy speed that you get. so i recommend it also:)
So the two batteries will power all 4 motors for a reasonable time then?
yeh easy
I advise doing the mathmatics for the problem rather than assuming they will be fine.
The basic way to think about it, batteries capacity is given in Amps per hour (Ah). In other words if a battery is sold as 2Ah then it will provide 2 amps of current for a solid hour (at least in theory it will). Now we can use this to work out if the battery will last in battle. A battle is around 3 minutes long. That is 1/20th of an hour so the 2Ah battery will be able to supply 40amps for that battle (again in theory, it does depend on the batteries internal chemistry if it can make this figure). Good batteries should always be able to tell you their constant discharge rate and their short term discharge rate. The second being used when a large amount of current is required at a motors start up. With regards to a drill motor, I'd say a good average for the time in battle will be of the order of around 10 to 15amps average over the entire battle. Lets say because you are using 4 drill motors each motor needs 10Amps average to push featherweights around for a full 3 minutes. So your drive will require 40amps continuously over the entire battle. You can then use this figure to see if your battery will last the full time.
There are always assumptions in this calculation (there always are in any engineering question) but the key is to reduce their impact on the real world solution. I therefore always like to over engineer robots, throw in more capacity than is required and beef things up. Of course this comes with weight problems but its all part of the bigger problem of coming up with a reliable machine.
Cool so by that logic 3.7 provided by those batteries should be enough (i assumer 3700mAh =3.7Ah)
it does i let you work out Gary's math
you will see with robnoteers a slight split one side being the math side really getting things perfect so they 'shouldn't' go dodgy others will guess and hope for the best. saying this i myself differ with approaches depending on what robot i'm building
have fun,
alex