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Well i will still have 2 seperate links, one ontop, and one underneath incase its flipped over.
Just my top main link will be underneath the disc, altho i have prcedures to stop the disc spinning!
I may need to rebuild the centre axle but i have also toyed with the idea of having an underneath link like mauler, just very unreliable.
Grant
I think the main thing is that it is bloody scarey removing a link in a full body spinner even when it appears to be fine after a fight. I for one would not want to turn the thing over while its still live to get to the link!
Also, Ive had damage to mine and when I pulled the link it span up! how? well, the wires had been crushed to the body by a vertical crusher (mentioning no names cooper snr) and the pull on the link was enough to short the wire to the body which was used as the negative of the robot, like in a car, and like in Mute. The moral there is, if the link had been on a part that spins Id be typing this with missing fingers.
Just my bit of input, we can have a chat about the FBS at my house warming if you want Grant.
Cheers
James,
The moral of the story is if you are using a negative earth chassis, then use heavy duty insulation on your wires.... like 170A truck motor starter cable :proud:
The insulation on our stuff is TOUGH, so tough that we cut it with a hacksaw - a stanley knife barely marks the stuff.
Why do I get cold shivers when someone mentions Mute and short circuits in the same sentence???
Julian: Call me a wimp, but the idea of relaxing safety restrictions for full body spinners (especially on the grounds that theyre too dangerous to go near anyway) doesnt appeal.
If a robot goes nuts (in the ignoring-remote-kill sense), it probably needs stopping before the batteries go, if only for the sake of the arena. If the accepted procedure is to pin it against the arena wall (with a house robot, in the Robot Wars case) so the link can be pulled, Id be a lot happier with the concept of pulling it out if the thing cant suddenly wrench my arm off should it slip free.
Mind you, presumably most of the time its a problem for the owner, and since I dont intend to build an FBS its not my problem!
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Fluppet
Hope the reference wasnt taken with offence Daniel, simply adding a respected name to the post as no doubt there were responses of well what a stupid.... on the way if people didnt realize that I wasnt the only one to do this.
For me, if a hypothetical FBS of mine goes out of control (even a 12kg one), Im switching the controller off and waiting for it to fall asleep. Any talk of me going in with it to pull the link will be met with laughter. I would say that for all spinner actually, if I built it, chances are its whip your hand off, so I aint feeding it bits of me thank you very much.
As I said, pulling the link on a perfectly (apparently) fine robot with juice still in the batts is nerve racking enough.
But what if you dont have the luxury of allowing your spinner to run out of power ? Like: people are in immediate danger, cant get away, spinner moving erratically ?
No, I for one will never allow the removable link rule to be bent. It exists for a very solid reason.
When you design/build a robot you should always put the link in mind first, dont save it as an afterthought. I would recommend that to any rooky roboteer... and some of the old ones.
Personally, the only way that seems safe to me is to put your link out of reach of your weapon, then out of the path of your robot, then see how you can make it safer still. Ideally the link would be accessible from all angles in all circumstances but it may never be, but strive towards that goal. The removable link IS practically the most important part of your robot.
Not saying we should relax any rules Babeth, just saying that I will personally refuse to pull the link on any out of control spinner, and some flipper. I would not pull Rips link if hes dancing with aan out of control flipper for example, as Im a big chicken.
To put this in perspecive, James Cooper and I own an arena. We are spending a bucket load of cash bringing it up to what we hope will be a class 1 featherweight arena definition. (this currently is not a class that exists.)
We are not doing this because we felt the old arnea wasnt safe, we are doing it because if...
Tantrum, Vortex, etc etc (Horizon) went ape at the start of the fight, the old arena (while still being able to safely contain it) may have taken significant wall damage while we went for a cup of tea (waiting for the batts to die). There is no question of us opening that arena till the things dead, and there is no way we will allow anyone else in there.
The new arena gives use that luxury. If Horizon (who is allegedly the most powerful featherweight spinner ever built, but Ed is about as keen to disclose info about is as Kermit the Frog is to eat bacon after supper. his call) went out of control, we can reliably say that cease would be called, and if the roboteers fightin him want to spend the next 10 mins or so running away thats up to them (they will not be allowed to attack!) as that arena stays locked til Horizon (for want of a more appropriate example) has fallen asleep. We can then get on with the next fight.
If you dont have the luxuary of allowing the spinner to do this, what situation have you created? it should be in an arena, it should not have people in it, and it should be capable of containing the rogue spinner.
Just my take on things.
I agree with you there james, i cannot see anybody jumping into an arena with an out of control spinner.
The most important thing i feel is,
If the event organiser allows a spinner to fight in the arena, that means the organiser realizes the risk of running that specific robot and is sure that under NO circumstances could the robot escape in a worst case senario.
Therefore there would be no saftey risk in allowing it to go crazy until the battries die.
if there is a saftey risk in allowing this to happen, then the event organiser has made a wrong decision regarding the risks involved with running that specific robot
yer thats ok james, will sort it out at your house warming, btw when is that?
I will bring it along and show you how far ive got,
as Babeth said, put your link out of reach of your weapon, then out of the path of your robot,
Its a FBS, its not very possible, not that i can see anyhow.
And yes i agree with james there, i would much rather leave my batts to die if my robots out of control, and if i put my main robot PloughBot in the areana with horizon and horizon went out of control then i wouldnt complain about mine being in there with it out of control, rather my robot than me :)
tahnks for your help
Grant
This all sounds a little dangerous and very expensive to me. Im quite happy with the concept that nobody should be approaching an uncontrolled robot - but control is a loose thing.
If a full body spinner goes King B, are the opponents really going to be happy about the damage their robots take if they cant get them out of the way? Its not like they can tap out. Saying they can dodge is all very well, but an FBS can shift across the arena at a fair lick if it ricochets off something.
The arena itself may contain anything the robot can do, but its likely to take expensive damage which may weaken it for future use. Im not sure that relying on the batteries dying us so wise, other than as a last resort.
The circumstances Im thinking of are where something can act as house robot, and can act to immobilise the out-of-control machine (although an OOC machine may well immobilise itself by getting wedged in railings, under an angle grinder, or similar). That leaves the question of how you tell the difference between a flat battery and a machine with a loose internal connection (Supernova) which will come back to life when you approach.
Under those circumstances, where the machine is restrained, I think its appropriate to try to remove the link. This presumes that the link can be removed easily, and doesnt involve two hands on the link and two feet on the armour. Leaving an OOC robot wedged with its motors stalled may cause damage to its motors, speed controllers, or other components, and pose a fire risk.
As an example of what Im getting at, if Typhoon went nuts, Id rather see Killalot pin it in the corner of the arena so the link can be (carefully) pulled than leave it to trash the arena (a non-trivial amount of Makrolon) before going flat - even assuming it didnt manage to jump the wall. Similarly if it got wedged in the wall.
Of course Im not suggesting anyone go in the arena while the robots are free to move, but Id consider the above to be the lesser of two evils. Whether its worth risking is highly dependent on circumstances.
Nonetheless, its an option Id rather have than not have. And if Im going to pull the link from an active, out of control robot (under admittedly exceptional circumstances), Id like to keep my fingers when the machine comes back to life, the spinner slips against the wall, or I accidentally dislodge it. I certainly dont want my fingers stuck inside when the thing catches fire.
As for robots escaping... its impossible to cater for *every* worst case scenario. We can keep the level of safety as high as possible, but actually making it impossible for the robots to escape if something weird happens is prohibitively expensive. The old OOTAd spinner thing is very expensive to counter.
Sorry to harp on about this from a position of inexperience, but Im wary of anyone deciding that making the robot safe is the event organizers problem, not theirs. As an arena owner, James may be happy for feathers to do their worst to his creation, but an arena which takes no damage from a heavy doing the same is a rare thing, and there are other factors involved.
Im with Babeth on this one - if its difficult to make the link accessible, try harder. Everyone else has had to. Sorry to be harsh.
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Fluppet